"Hey there! I was checking out your tumblr and you mentioned somewhere that just because you are anti-feminist, it doesn't mean that you are sexist. Could you elaborate on that/point me to a post where you do? To me it seems like it's a huge paradox - as in, feminism is basically against sexism, so being anti-feminist could pretty much translate to supporting sexism. Thanks for your time!"
Asked by antique-mango
I guess the problem is/was the difference in our definition of the terms. Thing is, I believe your definition of feminism would be the description of Second-wave feminism, which is/was indeed a faulty movement, but screw it, I’m not going to analyze that. Long story short, I guess you mean the feminism=’equality’ ideology, while I mean the feminism=liberation definition.
I can see how the things you listed seem discriminatory (except if you mean the right to have an abortion when you write “Reproductive Rights”, then I cannot see it, but whatever, that’s a different story). Nevertheless, I can also see these as sort of compensations for the sexism women* face. Obviously, the ideal state of affairs would be the erasure of sexism and thus these ‘compensations’.
Also, relief from compulsory military service is kind of an odd one out, as it was never asked for by women/feminists. It’s the still deeply rooted belief that (most) women are incapable of completing any kind of military training that spawned this derogatory privilege.
See, the thing about relief from compulsory military service, is that Feminism actually did ask for it, but in a kind of round-about way. They just asked for the right to vote, which they were given with no strings attached. Men, on the other hand, have to sign up for the draft (in the US at least), or they can not vote (among other things). This means that, for men, voting is something we actually have to earn. Men do not have the right to a vote.
I don’t define Feminism as anything. I simply judge Feminism based on the actions of its most influential, powerful, and most supported groups. Groups like the NOW, or the CAEFS in Canada.
I did not mean the right to an abortion for men. Well, I suppose you could call it a “financial abortion” essentially. When I talk about reproductive rights, for men, I mean the right to be able to say “No, I don’t want to be a father.” and for them to not have to support the child (of course this wouldn’t be an option any longer than a woman’s abortion would).
And you think women are the one facing the most sexism today? You think women are the ones that need “compensation”?
When young and baby boys are allowed to be circumcised worldwide, despite all of the health organizations that are against it, and one of the main reasons for children being circumcised is actually just vanity?
When women make up 11% more of the voters than men do, and yet men pay 115% more taxes than women do, meaning that men have virtually no say in how their tax dollars are spent?
When politicians, come reelection day, will always try to please women, due to them being the largest voting demographic?
When men receive prison sentences 63% longer than that of a woman who committed the same crime?
When women hold 65% of the country’s wealth?
When men are more likely to be the victims of every violent crime, of which rape is included?
When men commit suicide at least 3 times as often as women?
When men can simply be accused of rape once, and have their name plastered over every news article and tv station for miles, destroying their lives and reputation regardless of whether they did it or not?
And you want to sit here and act like all of the benefits that women get are “compensation” for the sexism THEY suffer? No, see, it’s not compensation for anything. It’s just benefits. Benefits of simply being a woman. Privilege, you could call it.
Now, I guess you’ve participated in such a conversation before, so I bet you’ve heard the “it’s patriarchy” argument. As far as I see it (and you might argue that it is not very far), all points you mentioned are consequences of the patriarchal system. In order to maintain the sexism that is in place, it is necessary to oppress femininity, but it is also necessary to praise and glorify masculinity, which results in shit loads of problems for both genders.
Oh wonderful. I was hoping you wouldn’t be one of the “patriarchy hurtz men too!!!!” types. Looks like I was wrong.
So the basic idea is that men are strong, women are weak. Men are independent and heroic, while women are dependent and faint-hearted. Which then, ‘of course’, means that if a man is abused in any way - especially if it is by a woman - and dares to speak about it, he becomes an enemy for patriarchy, as he perpetuates the idea that men might not be stronger than women.
Actually, the reason for men not being taken seriously when they report abuse is because of the way the laws are set up. Rape laws in western society say that a man being “forced to penetrate” somebody is not rape, despite it being the most common form of sexual assault against men.
In addition, Feminists put the Duluth Model into place. Know what that does? It says that MEN are always the aggressors in domestic violence, and that WOMEN are always the victims.
Funny, I thought Feminists wanted women to NOT be seen as victims all the time?
Circumcision: I must admit this is the first time I’ve heard about this issue. At my country it is rarely done, and then it is because of religious reasons. I would rather not comment on topics I am not in the least familiar with, so sorry - I’ll have to skip this point.
Well let me just add a little something here then. It’s estimated that 1/3 of all men in the world (that comes out to over 1 billion men) have experienced Male Genital Mutilation (circumcision). By comparison, only 100-140 million women have experienced Female Genital Mutilation.
Yes, men work more hours than women. Yes, man get injured/die more often in workplaces than women. Which is mainly because patriarchal culture, where it is an accepted “job” for a woman to be a full-time mother (thus not “working” at all), and where it is not accepted for a woman to risk her life/safety at work. Society pressures women not to take up certain jobs, because those are “too dangerous for women”, or “very tough”, or “would bore women”. On the other side, men have pressure too in this area, and the difference can be clearly seen in those damn Christmas brochures full of children’s toys. You’re a girl? Here, have princesses who do nothing! And toy kitchens! Also, have some soft, fluffy stuff that cannot possibly hurt you in any way. You’re a boy? Here, a firefighter truck for you! And toy guns! Basically stuff that’s mostly made of hard plastic, and is capable of terrorizing half the family with it’s loud sounds and flashing lights (later on enjoy the motherfucking war patriarchy will send you to). Patriarchy conditions men and women from a very young age to later on make the “natural” choice and take up jobs that further reinforces the pattern.
Actually, the problem with women not being in the dangerous jobs is simply that women don’t want them. Even in Sweden, the country with the title of “Most Equal country in the world”, they can’t get large numbers of women to go into STEM fields or other male-dominated professions for more than a couple years. No matter what they do, the women simply aren’t as interested in the jobs that are typically male-dominated.
I watched the video, but I got a slightly different conclusion. First of all, I believe the two (major) reasons for her severe depression were the ones she mentions towards the end: she realized that men do not have it “better” than women, they have it different, plus she also felt guilty because she “infiltrated” men’s ranks. Honestly, I think that any man who would have to live as a woman for a year would have a very similar result. But, well, let’s not start a misery war which would only strengthen the patriarchal system.
And I’m sorry, but the fact that there are more women who could vote than men, yet men still pay more taxes is just not a privilege. It can mean a variety of things, one of which is that men are generally richer than women. I could use this fact to validate the existance of the wage gap. I could use this fact to say that most women are tax cheats. And while “men have virtually no say in how their tax dollars are spent” sounds quite shocking, I think the people who actually decide how to spend those dollars sit in the Congress. And the majority of them are men.
The reason men pay more taxes is because they work more hours, so they have more money that can be taxed. This is because women are more likely to work part time than men are, and obviously part-time pays less than full-time.
I guess politicians try to appeal to women because women make up 11% more of the possible voters than man? That would make some sense. Or they have realized that women are a demographic they have not yet tried to appeal to? It happens ever so often with pensioners in Europe.
You do realize that women have been the majority of voters since the 60s right? Most of this shit that hurts men has been going on for decades, it’s not new.
The article practically said that researchers found the differences between the behaviour of boys and girls in school cause bias in the teachers, so that they favour girls, probably because there is less trouble with them. As to the “from kindergarted up to university”, I would like to quote from the last paragraph of said article: “researchers from the University of Missouri found in July that boys’ classroom behavior can actually work in their favor by the time they enter middle school”.
That article also said that boys who acted more like girls got treated better than the girls themselves. Here’s another article that explains it much better.
“Why are schools failing our boys?
The problems start early. Boys’ fine-motor skills and cognitive skills develop later than girls’ so they lag behind girls throughout much of early school life.
Once in school, young boys find it physically difficult to sit still for long periods.
Teachers used to be able to work around this by developing techniques of teaching in an outdoor physical environment but the new curriculum with its emphasis on literacy and numeracy hours means a return to formal, classroom-based teaching.”
The difference in the length of prison sentence is, again, a result of how men and women are presented by society, which constantly places women in the victim’s position. Thus it’s not hard to see how the cognitive disparity (women should be weak and defendable - damn this women commited a crime) leads to a less harsh sentence. The ‘poor, emotional woman’ trope is often well-played by lawyers.
How do women own 65% of the country’s wealth? I’m generally curious now.
While looking up some information to answer that, I found something else that’s pretty interesting.
- The number of wealthy women in the U.S. is growing twice as fast as the number of wealthy men.
- Women represent more than 40 percent of all Americans with gross investable assets above $600,000.
- 45 percent of American millionaires are women.
- 48 percent of estates worth more than $5 million are controlled by women, compared with 35 percent controlled by men.
- 60 percent of high net worth women have earned their own fortunes.
Then we should also talk about where do men are more likely to be a victim of violent crimes. Prison. Which is an entirely different, but really prevalent problem. Also, most of those violent crimes there stem from the need to assert one’s dominance over the others, which, in turn, comes from the patriarchal idea that a man’s worth equals his power.
Actually it happens in a lot of places, prison being just one. Even in prison, 65% of inmates experiencing “staff sexual misconduct” identified a female staff member.
2004 Study of teacher sexual misconduct. Those that are punished/reprimanded (96% male, 4% female) and those reported by students (57% male, 43% female)
Suicide is considered to be the very last resort, something that often could be prevented by seeking help from a psychologist, or so do I remember from my psych classes. There is another thing I remember from there: in “masculine" cultures (the US ranks pretty high there) people are less likely to ask for psychological help. Also, overall, men feel more ashamed if they go and see a psychologist, as we are conditioned to believe that only the weak (er… women) need that kind of help, men can take care of their mental health. If a woman complains about feeling really stressed, burnt out, etc., the advice is often to kick back, relax, or maybe go and see a damn psychologist. If a man complains about the same, the reaction is mostly somewhere along the line of "suck it up". Two sides of the same coin.
And yet we continue to focus on solving the problem of women *attempting suicide* instead of men that actually *complete suicide*.
What happened was unjust, yes, but what about those cases of rape the police never even investigates because they don’t believe the victim was actually raped? And only an estimated 2 to 8 percent of rape accusations are false.
That number comes from only one study, a study which is now over 25 years old. In addition, it only counts the cases in which a person is convicted for making a false accusation (which rarely happens). It entirely leaves out the accusers who recant their stories as well as cases in which the accused is acquitted.
A former director of the New York Sex Crimes District was even quoted as saying “We receive approximately 4000 reports of sexual assault each year. Of these, about half simply did not happen.”
Again, let me introduce a new viewpoint to the problem (homelessness). Women are, to put it nicely, are more sought after, so many women choose the “sex for shelter” option, Also, homeless women are more likely to be with a young child in custody then men, and thus are receiving more help for housing. Another thing: many become homeless because of mental illnesses, which, as I said above, are more likely to go untreated in men.
But dealing with women’s issues does not help them. “Destroying the patriarchy” doesn’t help men when women are the only ones feeling “liberated” by it.
Did I mention the impact of patriarchy when it comes to gender roles? British Airways, deciding that obviously all women must be kind, nurturing and generally harmless, unaccompanied minors should be seated next to them. The same false dichotomy that applies to pretty much all situations in our lives is at play here, and yes, now it’s harmful for men. The problem remains the patriarchal system.
Or, you know, you could simply admit that it’s sexism against men instead of trying to frame everything that hurts men as sexism against women? Jesus christ, it’s like playing “Wheel of Victim Complex” with you I swear.
Feminism is hardly against sexism. If anything, Feminism practices it.
Domestic abuse shelters, Scholarships, Special protections against violence, Special Government benefits, Reproductive Rights, Divorce benefits, Relief from compulsory military service, Grants, programs, and quotas.
All given to women only, courtesy of Feminism.
No, I don’t want to just “sit here and act like it’s a compensation”, thanks for your inquiry. What I want is to dismantle the fucking patriarchy that makes both men and women miserable. On that bright note, I’m gonna post this without editing.
It’s not “the patriarchy” making anyone miserable. It’s Feminists.